New technique for pain management

hossingaround · 03-04-08, 11:46 PM

I was reading an article earlier today about a new technique that's being developed to alleviate pain in horses with injured limbs. It involves putting catheter along nerves in the front leg containing what's called a CPNB or continuous peripheral nerve block. While it's going to take a few more years of research and testing, the new technique shows promise. The researchers believe it will save many horses from being euthanized as it should help prevent laminitis. Even just the pain relieving aspect is a wonderful thought.

EmmaB · 03-05-08, 10:12 AM

That would indeed be wonderful. So many horses could benefit from this as well as the people who love and care for them.

ellie · 03-05-08, 03:23 PM

Is this setup along the lines that a block is done when a female (human) is pregnant, the thing that is a little different than an epidural? I think its called a spinal block maybe?

HairyHorse · 03-05-08, 06:54 PM

It's more like a pundental block, used during delivery. An epidural totally paralyses the woman, or should do. Where as the block should allow you to walk around if you choose to.

There would be no benefit to paralysing a horse, instead they just aiming to paralyse essentially, one single nerve. It should be a hugely help eventually.

swish'n'neigh · 03-07-08, 12:53 AM

Wow, that sounds like an amazingly wonderful, yet amazingly expensive treatment. Is is something in place permanently or just for a few hours, or during healing or what?

Adelaide · 03-07-08, 10:06 AM

If it was to treat a fairly long term condition it would have to be in place long term I would guess. Pain meds wear off, and need to be re-administered. You would not be able to put in place a catheter like that every time you needed to give a shot, as you would be risking the veins.

Humans have ports and saline locks put in place all the time, so I don't think that would be a problem.

**alexis** · 03-07-08, 02:42 PM

I wonder what the price of something like this would end up running. I am sure it would be pretty pricey, but well worth it if really needed too. I know that epidural can cost about a grand for childbirth (done it twice now), and the blocks are different. Though with a human the blocks have risks, do they the same with horses?

flatback_frannie · 03-09-08, 12:24 AM

Alexis, I was thinking the same thing. If it's a vein, don't they do a heparin lock? Those carry a fairly significant risk, and after a while (a couple days) you often have to change veins with an IV. I wonder if it is the same for a nerve block?

HairyHorse · 03-10-08, 10:49 AM

Well there are things that can be permanently placed in a human. Think of people getting chemo or other treatments through a central line, or those who get dialysis on a regular basis, also through a permanent line (placed eventually, not often right away as there is a waiting list for many surgeries). I can't remember where a dialysis line is placed though.

Anyway, it is possible to have one placed permanently. The problem with saline or hep locks, is that they become blocked normally. A port suffers from this a lot less, same with a central line. So there may well be ways-I mean a horse's vein and arteries might be a lot different than ours in regards to coping with these.

barnbum · 03-10-08, 12:36 PM

There is always a risk when messing around with the normal working of a body. Even is its meant to fix existing conditions its not the way nature designed the organism and can lead to issues.

This does sound like a wonderful thing, even if its a last resort, as it gives another alternative in treating issues. It does sound expensive though, but everything a vet or doctor does is expensive these days.

03-04-08, 11:46 PM	#1 (permalink)
hossingaround Member Join Date: 01-03-08 Posts: 50	New technique for pain management I was reading an article earlier today about a new technique that's being developed to alleviate pain in horses with injured limbs. It involves putting catheter along nerves in the front leg containing what's called a CPNB or continuous peripheral nerve block. While it's going to take a few more years of research and testing, the new technique shows promise. The researchers believe it will save many horses from being euthanized as it should help prevent laminitis. Even just the pain relieving aspect is a wonderful thought.

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03-05-08, 10:12 AM	#2 (permalink)
EmmaB Member Join Date: 03-02-08 Posts: 3	That would indeed be wonderful. So many horses could benefit from this as well as the people who love and care for them.

03-05-08, 03:23 PM	#3 (permalink)
ellie Member Join Date: 03-02-08 Posts: 24	Is this setup along the lines that a block is done when a female (human) is pregnant, the thing that is a little different than an epidural? I think its called a spinal block maybe?

03-05-08, 06:54 PM	#4 (permalink)
HairyHorse Member Join Date: 02-02-08 Posts: 50	It's more like a pundental block, used during delivery. An epidural totally paralyses the woman, or should do. Where as the block should allow you to walk around if you choose to. There would be no benefit to paralysing a horse, instead they just aiming to paralyse essentially, one single nerve. It should be a hugely help eventually.

03-07-08, 12:53 AM	#5 (permalink)
swish'n'neigh Member Join Date: 03-02-08 Posts: 25	Wow, that sounds like an amazingly wonderful, yet amazingly expensive treatment. Is is something in place permanently or just for a few hours, or during healing or what?

03-07-08, 10:06 AM	#6 (permalink)
Adelaide Member Join Date: 03-02-08 Posts: 25	If it was to treat a fairly long term condition it would have to be in place long term I would guess. Pain meds wear off, and need to be re-administered. You would not be able to put in place a catheter like that every time you needed to give a shot, as you would be risking the veins. Humans have ports and saline locks put in place all the time, so I don't think that would be a problem.

03-07-08, 02:42 PM	#7 (permalink)
alexis Super-Moderator Join Date: 08-10-07 Posts: 329	I wonder what the price of something like this would end up running. I am sure it would be pretty pricey, but well worth it if really needed too. I know that epidural can cost about a grand for childbirth (done it twice now), and the blocks are different. Though with a human the blocks have risks, do they the same with horses?

03-09-08, 12:24 AM	#8 (permalink)
flatback_frannie Member Join Date: 01-06-08 Posts: 129	Alexis, I was thinking the same thing. If it's a vein, don't they do a heparin lock? Those carry a fairly significant risk, and after a while (a couple days) you often have to change veins with an IV. I wonder if it is the same for a nerve block?

03-10-08, 10:49 AM	#9 (permalink)
HairyHorse Member Join Date: 02-02-08 Posts: 50	Well there are things that can be permanently placed in a human. Think of people getting chemo or other treatments through a central line, or those who get dialysis on a regular basis, also through a permanent line (placed eventually, not often right away as there is a waiting list for many surgeries). I can't remember where a dialysis line is placed though. Anyway, it is possible to have one placed permanently. The problem with saline or hep locks, is that they become blocked normally. A port suffers from this a lot less, same with a central line. So there may well be ways-I mean a horse's vein and arteries might be a lot different than ours in regards to coping with these.

03-10-08, 12:36 PM	#10 (permalink)
barnbum Member Join Date: 03-07-08 Posts: 21	There is always a risk when messing around with the normal working of a body. Even is its meant to fix existing conditions its not the way nature designed the organism and can lead to issues. This does sound like a wonderful thing, even if its a last resort, as it gives another alternative in treating issues. It does sound expensive though, but everything a vet or doctor does is expensive these days.